tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post3872132695551588479..comments2024-03-01T04:59:47.946+00:00Comments on The Bible illustration blog: David and Goliath, and Philistine ArmorBible artisthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11875939553176288499noreply@blogger.comBlogger51125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-71906927259221292312017-07-26T10:14:16.272+01:002017-07-26T10:14:16.272+01:00Thanks for that Laura. I hadn't really thought...Thanks for that Laura. I hadn't really thought about that! I always presumed that it was speaking about the size and weight when comparing the shaft to a weavers beam, in which case, I probably should have drawn it a little larger than I have.<br /><br />To answer your question properly we would need to know if weavers beams were generally carved with decorative patterns? I can't think of a reason why they would be but it's an interesting thought. <br /><br />I think if the shaft was elaborately carved it might mention in the description that it was 'adorned' like a weavers beam. Bible artisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11875939553176288499noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-11172608063650751722017-07-25T21:09:23.204+01:002017-07-25T21:09:23.204+01:00Studying up on this story for VBS and looking for ...Studying up on this story for VBS and looking for a more correct picture of Goliath and his weapons. Talking about the spear, and "the shaft like a weavers beam..." Not knowing much about spears and weapons, envisioned the shaft looking like it was braided or woven, as in decorative. Just a thought...Lauranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-90806063724372058872017-07-25T21:08:14.620+01:002017-07-25T21:08:14.620+01:00Studying up on this story for VBS and looking for ...Studying up on this story for VBS and looking for a more correct picture of Goliath and his weapons. Talking about the spear, and "the shaft like a weavers beam..." Not knowing much about spears and weapons, envisioned the shaft looking like it was braided or woven, as in decorative. Just a thought...Lauranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-21758545954242234582017-01-27T15:04:15.178+00:002017-01-27T15:04:15.178+00:00I've heard people preach that Goliath was defe...I've heard people preach that Goliath was defeated because he had a chink in his armor. That is absurd; there was no chink in Goliath's armor; David had enough time to study Goliath and he exploited his weaknesses. Goliath was arrogant and boastful, full of pride, and he trusted too much in his armor. Goliath also underestimated David's skill with a sling.<br /><br />Judges 20:16, Among all this people there were seven hundred chosen men lefthanded; every one could sling stones at an hair breadth , and not miss.<br /><br />This account from the book of judges speaks about a level of precision comparable to that of a sniper from long range. A hair breadth is the thickness of one strand of hair. These men were experts at hitting their targets and would not miss. Goliath on the other hand was armored from his head to his feet. <br /><br />1 Samuel 17:5-6; And he had an helmet of brass upon his head, and he was armed with a coat of mail; and the weight of the coat was five thousand shekels of brass. And he had greaves of brass upon his legs, and a target of brass between his shoulders.<br /><br />Think about this; how could David hit Goliath in the forehead with a stone if the helmet was designed to protect the whole head? Have you ever thought about that? Goliaths armor was designed to protect him from a frontal attack. David knew that he didn't stand a chance in a hand to hand fight with Goliath. David was not counting on his strength; he was waiting for Goliath to make a mistake and expose his weakness!<br />1 Samuel 17:43-44; And the Philistine said unto David, Am I a dog, that thou comest to me with staves? And the Philistine cursed David by his gods. And the Philistine said to David, Come to me, and I will give thy flesh unto the fowls of the air, and to the beasts of the field.<br /><br />David was setting Goliath up! He approached Goliath with a stick to make Goliath think that the fight was going to be hand to hand combat. David had a secret weapon and he waited until the right moment to spring his trap. Goliath was waiting for David to make the first move but as Goliath was getting up David ran towards him.<br /><br />1 Samuel 17:48-49; And it came to pass, when the Philistine arose, and came and drew nigh to meet David, that David hasted, and ran toward the army to meet the Philistine. And David put his hand in his bag, and took thence a stone, and slang it , and smote the Philistine in his forehead, that the stone sunk into his forehead; and he fell upon his face to the earth.<br /><br />So how was David able to hit Goliath on the forehead if his helmet would have covered the forehead? The answer is very simple; as David approached Goliath with a stick in his hand Goliath expected to fight David with his hands. David's taunting infuriated Goliath so that when Goliath arose he either took his helmet off or forgot to put it on! This was not a surprise attack; David was counting on Goliath to be disoriented and befoe Goliath could settle himself David pulled out his secret weapon. That's when David took out his sling and hit Goliath on his weak spot once it was exposed. The enemy is not relying on his or your strengths, he's relying on your weaknesses! Prepare yourself!<br /><br />Are we learning yet?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14482019827301017711noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-46020445525684609472016-12-28T01:46:45.633+00:002016-12-28T01:46:45.633+00:00Where did the shield bearer go?Where did the shield bearer go?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-37032713554551931022015-06-23T21:19:40.560+01:002015-06-23T21:19:40.560+01:00Good points! Thanks for that Kurt!Good points! Thanks for that Kurt!Bible artisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11875939553176288499noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-62533600971886157112015-06-06T18:59:16.611+01:002015-06-06T18:59:16.611+01:00Goliath was nearly twice the height of the average...Goliath was nearly twice the height of the average man of that day, whether or not the Philistines wore greaves they were a practical necessity for him, lest he have his legs cut out from under him in the middle of battle.<br /><br />It occurs to me though... Goliath would have been a HORRIBLE line soldier. Excellent in Champion Battles used to prevent mass combat, but in the middle of mass combat he'd have a gigantic target on his back.Kyrt Ryderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09600938397472578939noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-62836000532940026822014-06-05T10:02:33.884+01:002014-06-05T10:02:33.884+01:00I stumbled across this site while researching for ...I stumbled across this site while researching for a figure or costume for Goliath for a friend's Sunday School next month. Thank you for such a well- researched illustration, and the chance to discuss it!<br /><br />Firstly, I am surprised that the term 'chivalry' has even come up-- not at the knightly anachronism, but that we must judge 2500- or- so- years- ago events as if they were played by our Marquess of Queensbury rules! From what I can remember of the text, here went the day: David, teenager, arrives with a care package for his older brothers, and finds a demoralized (and sadly shrunken?) Israelite army who have forgotten that they have God on their side. David wanders around the camp asking uncomfortable questions; his brother reproves him in big- brother language, but rumors get to Saul, who calls for the youngster. Meanwhile, I note that the camp <i>waits</i> for Goliath to deliver his daily challenge; I've always understood this to mean that he dresses and arms cap- a- pie, and parades around a bit all polished and grand and shouts at the Israelites awhile, and then goes back to his side and waits for someone to take up the challenge, though they should have come out at the time. <br /><br />So, we know David refuses Saul's arms and armor-- it all takes training to use that David never had. He readies what he's used to, his staff and sling.<br /><br />It has always seemed to me that David follows the same protocol that Goliath does-- an exchange of insults to set the mood and make sure of the intention to fight (or lose by default if, having thrown defiance, one runs off?) I don't see that David has any particularly superior position mentioned, although I think he might stop to use the sling, while Goliath continues to charge across the no- man's- land, ready to stab with or cast the spear. BTW, Goliath surely couldn't have been knocked <i>back</i> by a shot to the forehead if he was advancing; he'd have to collapse forward with the mass of himself plus all that armor in motion, no matter what normally happens when standing still. See Newton.<br /><br />Whether Goliath recognizes the sling as a danger is a separate question, because people with gigantism apparently have poor eyesight as a result; but Goliath certainly didn't feel himself at a a disadvantage or decline to meet a silly peasant boy with peasant weapons that the Israelites had let out to insult him-- he had his armor, iron and bronze and all. (Elizabethan English a la KJV doesn't always use 'brass' as precisely as we do now.)<br /><br />Anyway. That's long. Sorry. There's probably more to say (i.e., that swords 'most always come out second in battle, only after the more versatile and cheaper spear) but it's late.Chrisnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-61005229167460808172014-04-18T13:32:39.685+01:002014-04-18T13:32:39.685+01:00I always thought that David used what would be cal...I always thought that David used what would be called a "Staff Sling". I think the mechanics of a staff sling are more like a trebuchet or a catapult than the normal sling that has to be spun, which would account for Goliath just standing there and then suddenly taken down as David could have placed a rock into it and lobbed it into Goliath's forehead before he really had a chance to react. He thought David was coming to fight him with a staff and wound up attacked from the distance. Slings have existed for a very long time and have been used in virtually every engagement of the ancient world. I think Goliath would have been familiar with the sling and if David had tried to stand there and wind up to throw a stone/bullet, Goliath would have thrown his javelin at him or he would have tried to move out of the way if David was too far away.<br /><br />Second the Khopesh sword and coat of mail. I believe this event probably happened after the Sea People had been defeated and Goliath and his men would have been the survivors who surrendered to the Egyptians and then were conscripted into the Egyptian army then eventually resettled in Canaan. In this light , the weapons and armor make total sense. They would have been issued to Goliath when he was brought into the Egyptian army.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18029346924094649252noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-82790655103995588712014-04-08T15:55:29.277+01:002014-04-08T15:55:29.277+01:00YOU KNOW SOMEONE SAD ENOUGH TO COME AGAINST THE DA...YOU KNOW SOMEONE SAD ENOUGH TO COME AGAINST THE DAVID AND GOLIATH..SET FORTH AS A SHADOW FOR VICTORY IN OUR VERY LIFES TODAY HAS BEEN OVER TAKEN WITH WRONG GOD GAVE US ALL THESE THINGS TO SHOW US WE CAN MAKE IT IN ANY SITUATION ANY OLE GIANT IN OUR LIVES CAN B TAKEN DOWN WITH THE GREATNESS OF GODS POWER BEHIND IT..DRUGS,FEARS,TORMENTS,EVIL THOUGHTS CAN EVEN BE GIANTS THAT GIANT OF UNBELIEF IS A BIG ONE THAT COULD STAND A FEW ROCKS AND SLINGS..GOTTA NOTICE WITHOUT HOPE WE HAVE NOTHING WITH GOD WE HAVE HOPE AND CAN SLAY THE GIANTS TODAY IT IS A SHADOW I FEEL FOR OUR EVERYDAY LIFE..FAIR I TELL U WHO'S NOT FAIR THATS THE DEVIL HE WILL TAKE ONE AND DESTROY ALL HE OR SHE HAS AND LEAVE THEM TO SUFFER IN PAIN AND SHAME.. IM GLAD TO BE A GIANT KILLER...GREATER IS HE THAT IS IN ME... WHEN WE BECOME PART OF HIM HE IS PART OF US JESUS PAVED THE WAY EVEN BEFORE HE PAID THE ULTIMATE PRICE..SO DAVID A LAD DEFEATED THE GIANT AND THEY R STILL CRYING ABOUT IT STILL TODAY...NOT THEM BUT FOOLISH THINKERS..MUCH LOVE GET A GRIP Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-11892843747501258262013-12-14T11:43:13.140+00:002013-12-14T11:43:13.140+00:00I am speaking about David tomorrow, and his encoun...I am speaking about David tomorrow, and his encounter with Goliath so I really enjoyed reading your blog. If you get this in time, is there any chance you could send me that picture of Goliah and David to colin59dyer@gmail.com.<br /><br />I was wondering, your other pictures on the OT do not seem available yet on the Foundations Matters website. In fact, that site has not been updated for what seems a couple of years. Which seems a shame! As someone who has, off and on, used those pictures as a rescource, the lack of an update is disappointing. I would be using more of your pictures if they were there/available.<br /><br />Anyway, thank you for your writing. And I noted one author said something about the sling being less accurate than a spear or bow and arrow. Well, this seems to fly in the face of the evidence of Judges, where some Benjamites could (left handedly) hit a hair. And other resources that speak of Baeleric and other slingers (who trained from youth) who could not only hit a man's face at a distance, but also hit a specific part of that face.<br /><br />So I understand that David trained from his youth with the sling, and hitting Goliath in the forehead was a skill he had developed and was exceptional good at. But, without the Lord's help, and confidence in him, none of this would have happened. Nevertheless, the human skill of David was a part of the victory - the person God used to bring honour to His name and to demolish this insulting, violent enemy.Colinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08298371906693328768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-594187590703841332013-07-22T02:56:53.003+01:002013-07-22T02:56:53.003+01:00Actually early biblical texts say Goliath was 4 an...Actually early biblical texts say Goliath was 4 and a half stones tall not 6 and a half which would have made him 6 foot 8. someone who was 9 foot 9 would have looked like a demon not a giant. also modern bibles state that David threw the stone at his forehead and it dug into it and he fell forward(this would be scientifically impossible) the forward momentum of the stone would have been to great and would have forced him backward not forward, in reality the Hebrew word for forehead is similar to a Hebrew word for a part on the leg. so in other words its more likely he threw it at the part of the leg between armor and that he fell forward because he lost balanceAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-89486632334417810722012-07-01T19:30:53.813+01:002012-07-01T19:30:53.813+01:00The english word target, IN THIS CASE, also means ...The english word target, IN THIS CASE, also means the shortened version, a targ. Which USUALLY means a smaller, usually round, (hince the word) shield. For an average man, used to retangular shields, This targ could be anywhere from 1 to 3ft round, but sometimes in different configurations. I fought in the Society of Creative Anachronism for 25yrs, teaching the fighting for 10. I fought with 2 shields. One called a war board, was 3ft by 4ft. The other, I called a cavelry shield, was also called a snow shoe shield, as it looked in shape to be of that size and distinction.<br />If I were fighting in a shield wall, I used the war board. If I were fighting in the open, depending on the fluidity of the battle as I expected it to be, AND the experience of those I were fighting, if I knew it, AND this is talking of a melee type battle. I would use the snow shoe shield. IF I wanted to go on the offensive entirely, BUT might have to go defensive, I would fight with 2 swords only. Right hand up L hand down. The left became my shield, and tho it was thin, It also had the physilogical advantage of being an offensive weapon, and hince had to be considered as such by an opponet. Fighting this way, called Florientine) one must be standing on the toes of their opponit, and try to do damage with both swords. The L sword hilt even comes into play when fighting like this.<br /><br />I have used great swords, that were 6ft long. IF one is experienced with them, they are graceful, to an extent to use. They are also intimidateing. We do not know the length of Goloiths sword. But Im guessing that, since it was cast iron, that it couldnt have been as long as a scottish great sword ala Braveheart. But, with added thickness, he might have gotten it to 5ft which would have seemed long to a people whose swords were absolutly , in my mind no longer than the roman sword, IF that long.<br /><br />I have seen slingers. I would say, that IF Golith and David reacted to each other at the same instant, than Golith should have been able to withdraw his sword with the same speed David loaded and swung his sling. Warrors of old could draw there swords in the sameway that old west gunslingers could draw their pistols. FAST. What im trying to say. If you, whoever you reading this are, were to strap on a sword, having never had on one before, And you and Golith drew yours both at the same time. He would beat you all day long.<br />Was Golith setting in a chair. I dont know. I could see that tho. BUT I can tell you this. I dont know how long he stayed out in front of his army morning and night, BUT< I DO KNOW< that without a doubt, he removed it when he went behind his lines, to sit out the day under a tent with plenty of cool drink. With the help of his armourer, He could be totally rearmed in ONE MINUTE. Ive done it in that time myself with my armour. There would be absolutly no reason to remain in armour all day long.<br />As to his spear being a javlin. I have to doubt it. A javlin is a one shot wonder. U wonder if it will hit a target without deflecting from the armour of that target enough to penetrate and kill some one. AND, if it does, Thats it. Youve possibly lugged a javlin a hundred miles to kill one person, maybe. I much more likely imagine it as being a spear. The thickness is valuable more so for defenseive fighting, than for offensive throwing. IF it was thick enough, He could have held it in both hands, and blocked a vikings ax (so long as they met shaft to shaft). He could deflect lighter spears, tho they would be faster in motion. IF he threw it out at a target, holding it with one hand, and somewhat twisting his body in the direction of the hand he held it in, me not knowing if he was R oe L handed. A spear, that heavy and long, would have broke a shield of an opponet IF it didnt keep on going and break its owner.Ld Wilhelm Da Kaalavonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-88536608870757812462012-05-03T09:42:55.411+01:002012-05-03T09:42:55.411+01:00Glad to be of help Misha!Glad to be of help Misha!Bible artisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11875939553176288499noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-55020732742160431752012-05-03T03:54:38.276+01:002012-05-03T03:54:38.276+01:00thanks for this information i needed it for my BIB...thanks for this information i needed it for my BIBLE homworkmishahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05473736095792852887noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-27010444890257175832012-03-01T18:26:51.664+00:002012-03-01T18:26:51.664+00:00A few things we are forgetting that I saw mentione...A few things we are forgetting that I saw mentioned in earlier comments...David was not king at the time of this event. Goliath was not a Philistine, he was from Gath. I would venture to say he was a Philistine champion of sorts...like a gladiator...possibly a soldier of fortune.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-32717477013067570742011-12-26T15:52:04.314+00:002011-12-26T15:52:04.314+00:00Sorry Anonymous, I only keep my references for a f...Sorry Anonymous, I only keep my references for a few months in case I get questions like this shortly after posting. <br /><br />There are a number of scholarly articles on this subject online so keep searching! I probably should add a list of references after each post of this type listing all my sources - I'll try to do that in future!Bible artisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11875939553176288499noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-44315750341308316692011-12-20T00:23:09.232+00:002011-12-20T00:23:09.232+00:00Anonymous said at 12.07AM: "Do you possibly h...Anonymous said at 12.07AM: "Do you possibly have the sources on Goliath's sword?" I gave an answer, but maybe the questioned person is BiblicalArtist, and not me. If so, I apologise.<br /><br />There is absolutely reason to ask BiblicalArtist about his source of information on the sword of Goliat.<br /><br />I usualy read the danish translation of the Bible, and here Samuel 1.17.6-7 clearly states, that Goliat wear a sickle-sword of bronze on his back. (in danish of cause, translated to your benefit)<br /><br />But now I read the english translation, The King James version. Here I read (Sam.1.17.6) "...and a target of brass between his shoulters."<br /><br />Target and sicklesword of bronze are two very different words to me, so I would like to repeat the question: "Do you possibly have the sources on Goliath's sword?"<br />Or is there some problems with the interpretation of this piece of text?<br /><br />Furthermore brass and bronze are two very different metal-alloys.<br />You can imagine, that in the bronzeage they used bronze, so the english text apear even more enigmatic to me. Can you explain?<br /><br />Should I mention, that the sicklesword is first in use in Sumer, later in Assyria, The canaanite sicklesword is called a khopesh, "The khopesh went out of use around 1300 BCE." <br />(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khopesh) <br /><br />It is very peculiar that Goliat should have a sicklesword, outdated by 150 years and completely foreign to his etnic group.<br /><br />The seapeoples prefered the bronze "cut-and-trust-sword".Jens Bay DKnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-52659942373212177032011-12-13T00:39:16.004+00:002011-12-13T00:39:16.004+00:00You can find information on Mycenaean and sea peo...You can find information on Mycenaean and sea people/philistine swords here:<br /><br />http://www.salimbeti.com/micenei/weapons1.htm<br /><br />Especially the The Naue II sword is interesting.JensBay DKnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-48811592638915979062011-12-11T00:07:48.984+00:002011-12-11T00:07:48.984+00:00Do you possibly have the sources on Goliath's ...Do you possibly have the sources on Goliath's sword?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-91757197322137820232011-10-26T14:30:43.375+01:002011-10-26T14:30:43.375+01:00Very true Anonymous.Why waste time with a silly ar...Very true Anonymous.Why waste time with a silly argument?For me God reigns supreme in the David and Goliath story.The battle belongs to the Lord.<br />Saritasaritahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15651835831995838637noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-87870323037703898722011-06-27T20:29:41.962+01:002011-06-27T20:29:41.962+01:00It amazes me how some can just run around like a d...It amazes me how some can just run around like a dog chasing their tail Bottom line is either one believes the bible or not. There are a number of verses in the bible that say there were giants in the land in those days, even other civilizations had a few exceptions that with tall warriors or rulers. If the writers of these accounts go thru the trouble of mentioning the weight and comparative size of Goliath's weaponry, why the argument of how tall he was? Every persons DNA is different and what if this dude and his brothers didn't have brain defects but were descendants of Nephillin (if that school of thought is possible)? God killed Goliath with his vessel David. If he were here today he would probably say the same thing. :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-1146237690036392302011-02-17T20:22:29.664+00:002011-02-17T20:22:29.664+00:00Thank you for the kind words Graham
1. Sam. 17 tel...Thank you for the kind words Graham<br />1. Sam. 17 tells us that Goliat is a tall man, very tall indeed. <br />6 cubit and a span.<br />One egyptian cubit is 0.4527 meter and a span is 0.228 meter, so Goliat was very close to 3 meter high. We both know this is impossible, had Goliat been that tall, he had not been a great worrior, but an invalid, and had probably died very young. Todays worldrecord - a chinese - is 2.67 meter, and he cannot walk, almost cant bear himself, and his heart cant take the presure.<br />So you see, sometimes it is nessesary to make a spin, or let us say, a counterspin to find what is behind the story.<br />If one take the story at facevalue, one risk to lose ones way. Right.<br /><br />A second thing. It would improve your site, if you could show not only time, but also date, month and year, when a comment is posted.JensBay DKnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-42512367647740792132011-02-15T23:41:28.956+00:002011-02-15T23:41:28.956+00:00You put a very interesting spin on the story jensb...You put a very interesting spin on the story jensbay,Bible artisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11875939553176288499noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35459855.post-22758918441580781632011-02-15T23:14:34.230+00:002011-02-15T23:14:34.230+00:00I wrote: "and had he said: Prepare yourself, ...I wrote: "and had he said: Prepare yourself, and let us meet in this place in five or ten minutes".<br />He did not, he utters a curse, an insult, to unveil his murderous intents, when he was in a secure position, so Goliat had to move, but he was not first. <br />No, David did the first move, when he moved into a secure position, where he could strike and hit with his (until then hidden) weapon, and Goliat not with his. <br />Conserning how quick a sling can be loaded, David did it, after he spew his curse, while running against Goliat.<br />So Goliat had to move, but he was not nessesarily prepared, and dressed for battle. <br />No verse said that Goliat sat down to rest, but as I recall the Illiad, this was the usual thing to do when you have out an open challenge, so use your reason: Nobody can be ready and on the allert, and fully dressed for battle in all forty days, <br />from early morning til late evening in that devastating heat they have in Israel.<br />And you missed to explain, where was the helmet and shield of Goliat, that could have protected him against a flying stone, harmless when it hits a shield?<br /><br />It surprises me that you, son of Arthurian England have so little understanding of how to accept a challenge in a decent manner.<br /><br />Should I write the Philistine version? I think that Goliat was a very brave man, to put out an open challenge this way, he had no idea who he would meet, and he was a very patient man, to let the challenge stand open for whole forty days.<br />And he was a wise man, as only one of two have to die with this arangement, after the duel the two parties can sit down and negotiate.<br />yes the israelies betrayed the idea, when they assasinated a whole bunch of philistine.<br />And David later showed his true nature, when he fornicated with Abigail, and had Urias betrayed and killed.<br />David had three wifes, but that was not enough for this righteous man of God.<br />I think, that the Philistines were a highly cultered and civilised people. They mainly lived in five cities, the had an alphabet, and their handcraft was of very sophisticated quality. That counts for their boats, their weapons, their pottery and their international connections.<br />In opposition to the israelis, who at that time had no alphabet, only crude pottery and they were mostly selfsufficient farmers and goatshepherds living in hamlets.<br />I think a modern parallel would be Waziristan and New York, and what happened there? Religeous fanatisme had the first strike.<br />Indeed Israel have develloped since then.JensBay DKnoreply@blogger.com